Senate defeats proposal to trim food stamp program
Tuesday, June 19, 2012
WASHINGTON (AP) — The Senate on Tuesday began plowing through 73 amendments to a $500 billion bill that will set farm policy and fund the food stamp program over the next five years. One of its first votes was to reject a proposal to trim food stamp spending.
The farm bill, one of the last major pieces of legislation that could clear Congress before the election, carries out major changes to the federal safety net for farmers, replacing their direct payments, even when they don’t plant crops, with greater emphasis on crop insurance and a new program to protect farmers from revenue losses.
The Senate is expected to vote on all the amendments and pass the bill by the end of the week. It then goes to the House, where it could run into resistance from fiscal conservatives.
An early amendment in the Senate dealt with the price of the food stamp program, the Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program, which now totals $80 billion a year, about 80 percent of the bill’s spending. Food stamp rolls have doubled over the last eight years to 46 million people, driven by the recession.
The Democratic-led Senate defeated 56-43 a proposal by Sen. Jeff Sessions, R-Ala., that would have restored strict asset tests for food stamp eligibility. Households with gross incomes less than 130 percent of the poverty level and liquid assets below $2,000, or $3,250 for households with elderly or disabled people, qualify for food stamps. But Sessions says the asset test is widely ignored by states that allow the asset limit to be exceeded if a person receives other welfare benefits. He said his amendment would have saved taxpayers $11 billion over 10 years.
A second Sessions amendment, to prevent states from getting bonuses for increasing registration of food stamp recipients, was also defeated.
The base bill does save $4.5 billion over 10 years by ending another practice by some 15 states of giving low-income people as little as $1 dollar a year in home heating assistance, even when they don’t have heating bills, in order to make them eligible for increased food stamp benefits.
Sen. Kirsten Gillibrand, D-N.Y., sought to rescind those savings, saying the reduction would result in half-a-million households losing an average $90 in monthly food benefits, but her amendment went down 66-33. Senate Agriculture Committee chairwoman Debbie Stabenow, D-Mich., said the heating assistance loophole was “undermining the integrity of the program.”
Sessions had proposed another amendment that would have gone further in cracking down on the heating assistance practice, but it was among more than 200 that were not allowed in a deal on proceeding with the legislation reached by the two parties Monday.
Among the amendments that will be considered are those dealing with putting caps on crop insurance subsidies, and proposals dealing with the sugar growers’ protection program, maple syrup, catfish and aerial surveillance of farmland.
Also on the agenda were several amendments having nothing to do with farm policy, including a measure to cut off public funds for political party conventions and another demanding a report on the effects of automatic cuts in defense and other federal spending to take place next January.

Comments
spelchek 11 months ago
"When the food stamp program began in the 1970s, it was designed to help about 1 of 50 Americans who were in severe financial distress. But thanks to eligibility changes first by President George W. Bush as part of the 2002 farm bill and then by President Obama in the 2008 stimulus, food stamps are becoming the latest middle-class entitlement. A record 44.7 million people received food stamps in fiscal 2011, up from 28.2 million as recently as 2008. The cost has more than doubled in that same period, to $78 billion, and is on track to account for 78% of farm bill spending over the next decade. One in seven Americans now qualifies." -- No more pride or shame. What a pity.
dokeus6 11 months ago
Thanks to W's running of our country that is why the number went up.
You made the correlation yourself by this statement "But thanks to eligibility changes first by President George W. Bush as part of the 2002 farm bill and then by President Obama in the 2008 stimulus, food stamps are becoming the latest middle-class entitlement."
Who are you to wave YOUR finger?
GrumpyGus 11 months ago
I am a taxpayer who is not on the dole...that is why I am entitled to wave MY finger. You are going to have to get off your whipping boy Bush. By all accounts he grew government entitlements like any other Democrat and "moderate" Republican. You should be in love with his big spending ways, yet you bash him unending. Well if he should be vilified for his big spending, then Obama should be really blasted. He has raised deficit spending to a high art form.
Sequoia 11 months ago
I don't get this idea that spending itself is bad. No business, family or individual would ever say that spending, in and of itself, is a bad thing.
The question is value. How much value do we get for what we spend?
I think the point about Bush is that a lot of his spending, particularly the Iraq War, didn't produce anything of value.
In the old days, conservatives didn't argue with deficit spending just because it was deficit spending. Conservatives wanted to make sure we'd really be getting a good value for the dollar. Conservatives wanted to make sure that the liberals' plans would really work. Now, conservatives just use "spending" as a partisan bat to beat people over the head with.
I continue to be amazed at the disconnect between the Republican's argument that the federal government was competent enough to "transform the Middle East" with military intervention, and the current Republican argument that the federal government is not competent enough to address domestic problems. Conservatives should support institutions, like families, that make America strong. Sometimes that calls for spending to preserve those institutions.
We need to get back to the idea of "value." Seems like a word nobody uses anymore. Conservatives should be trying to conserve valuable things, like families. Even if you're not "on the dole" (you still recieve the benefit of many government services), you still benefit from families that are not desperate and panicked.
I don't believe the government can ever "cure" poverty, and it shouldn't try. The poor will always be with us. But, we can alleviate some of the desperation assoicated with poverty, and that's a good thing for me, so that my neighbors don't do something crazy that might hurt me.
tonto_goldberg 11 months ago
Sequoia12 minutes ago - "I don't get this idea that spending itself is bad."
Think about it. You know the answer. It's simplistic. It fits on a bumper sticker, or one of those "hand painted" placards the Americans for Prosperity people hand out for Tea Party rallies.
dokeus6 11 months ago
I am going to be on anyone who spends Billions of taxpayers dollars on a war that we had no business being in.
Government will never change because of the money that is flowing into both campaigns from corporations and banks and the powerful but silent men who control from behind the scenes.
spelchek 11 months ago
"Thanks to W's running of our country that is why the number went up." Really? Because the fact is the number people on food stamps has doubled since 2008. Bush was a lame duck in 2008. The cost has also doubled since 2008. Bush was a lame duck in 2008. Who controlled the purse strings from 2007-2010? Democrats. What sitting POTUS signed off on all Democrat passed bills? Obama. Facts are pesky things.
asb 11 months ago
Bush's innocense is a function of his tiny brain, not for anything he did or didn't do.
dokeus6 11 months ago
Did you even read your original post. You stated that it started in 2002. I was just making a inference based on your original statement. I will post it again for you to re-read.
These are your words not mine. " But thanks to eligibility changes first by President George W. Bush as part of the 2002 farm bill"
Yes facts are pesky things when they cause you to put your foot in your mouth.
dokeus6 11 months ago
Why has the cost doubled? Because more people are using the program. Why? Because of the economic condition our country is in. Why? Because of the leadership the country had in the previous eight years. Why? Because we elected a numbskull to run the country.
dokeus6 11 months ago
Give me reasons why things happen. Give me some answers grace. The same old answers are what you have. We need to move forward from this finger pointing debate about which political party is doing what to who. Do you honestly believe that things are going to change with a republican as a president? No they won't. They are not going to improve with a democrat as a president either. We have to take the initiative to make things better by standing up for our rights instead of squashing opinions and other people's voices.
JCLifer 11 months ago
Romney is a poor choice for president. Not much will change if he is elected. Ron Paul, Herman Cain, even Hillary would have been much better choices.
With either Romney or Obama, this economy is going to go belly-up, as well as our country. The fat-cats will be fine, but the middle class will be crushed to compete for the few leftovers with the impoverished. Getting a college degree and working hard doesn't help anymore.
spelchek 11 months ago
The fact you ignore the fact that in three years Obama has doubled down on welfare recipients all the while blaming Bush whom partially raised the entitlement costs in 6 years makes you an unworthy adversary. And you look extremely hypocritical blaming Bush for spending when you support a president and congress that has a spending problem. I know you think we're all dumb and will choose to ignore what's going on around us and keep telling ourselves "Change We Can Believe In" or "Hope", but the fact is we saw what this man was before he was elected unlike those who were mesmerized and hypnotized by slogans. You should have picked Hillary but too late for that now. Watch a Romney landslide this November and a republican take over of the legislative body. Then and only then, will stocks start to rise, unemployment will go down, and employers will start hiring again. All this done without Romney complaining almost 4 years into his presidency about "inheriting" anything. A leader is needed in D.C., not a perpetual cry baby and blamer.
dokeus6 11 months ago
But what is he spending the money on? What new programs did he create besides the health care act that is costing us trillions of dollars? Can you be specific ? I don't think your dumb, I think you fail to see that it is not only the President who is causing this mess. It is the way government has been run in the last 30 years. You want to stand up and praise republicans and shout out how great they are? What has made them so great? The reason we are in the economic shape is not from the last three years. It is from the last 35 to 40 years. Both parties. Everyone of the people we have voted in to represent us has failed us. They don't represent us they represent the big corporations and banks. That is where the power in this country lies.
tonto_goldberg 11 months ago
The food stamp program was part of the federal crop price support group of programs when it started. Then the feds noticed that better-fed kids did better in school. But like you say, no more pride or shame, and the program became extremely popular.
It is annoying to think that people on food stamps can eat better than working folks. Some people believe this, but the food stamp benefits aren't that good. Recipients can't eat steak and lobster all month - if they start out that way, the last couple weeks find them begging at the food pantry. The food pantry doesn't have any steaks or lobster.
spelchek 11 months ago
"...but the food stamp benefits aren't that good." -- I worked grocery stores growing up, you are wrong. They are very good. I would ring up 2 carts full in some cases and this was back in the early 90's. Any benefit you put nothing into and get something back is "good". Starving "aren't that good."
Sequoia 11 months ago
Anyone who wants to actually engage in THIS issue can read about it here, in the Atlantic... that 150-year old hippie rag:
theatlantic.com/business/archive/2012/06/why-are-republicans-waging-war-on-food-stamps-now/258794/
Littleinvestor 11 months ago
The income eligibility is on the SNAP website. It's $2422 monthly for a family of four, which seems out of whack for Central Mo to me. I would think a family of four would be OK with that amount of monthly income. But that amount may be out of whack in NYC or LA because housing is so much more expensive in those areas. Probably ought to be set regionally or let the states run the program and set the eligibility amounts.
jeffcitygirl 11 months ago
Little..that number is GROSS income, before taxes, not what the employee actually brings home. The NET income limit for a family of four is $1863 which is a net take home pay of a little over $400 a week. Not much when you have kids in day care or after school, rent, utilities, gas for your vehicle, not to mention doctor and medical copays, debt payments, etc. Most of the people who work do not qualify for other assistance with energy, day care, etc. Food stamps are the only thing that gets them by and most still struggle to live paycheck to paycheck.
John 11 months ago
And, as I understand it, there is a limit to how much your vehicle is worth. If you need a vehicle to get to work to earn money, but the care is a reliable one, worth more than a couple grand, you are not allowed food stams. Kinda stupid.
Littleinvestor 11 months ago
You may be right jeffcitygirl, but a family of four would have four deductions on their income tax so their take home might be more. I do the taxes for some family members and at that income they pay very little federal tax but each situation is different. I do know some people making way less than $2400 a month who are on food stamps. A couple of them are working two or more part time jobs and still struggle to feed their kids. I don't begrudge them the food stamps and hope they find better employment in the future.
spelchek 11 months ago
Jefferson City's main employer must have lots of employees on food stamps if what you say is true.
JCLifer 11 months ago
How many state workers with college degrees are elligible for food stamps? I know several.
JCLifer 11 months ago
I would hope that our public universities would not ne offering such rubbish these days. Didn't they purge these types of stuff out pf their systems a few years ago? On this economy public higher education institutions need to be focusing on job-generating degrees.
John 11 months ago
An E-5, over 8 with a spouse and 2 children qualifies for the food stamp program EXCEPT that they need a reliable car and, therefore, generally cannot qualify because their vehicle lists out too high.
viktorkowski 11 months ago
let me wrap my head around this. The us spends $80 billion a year on SNAP that feeds 46 million souls. That's quite a bit of people when you consider every year JP Morgan Chase gets $14.5 billion in subsidies yet that only goes to a handful of people. If you dig really hard you can see all kinds of handouts going to some very wealthy people. I'm not talking millionaire's here either, I'm talking billionaires. So when I hear of a family earning deplorable wages, wages that seemed to have decreased over the last 10 years, getting a few bucks to buy food with I don't even blink. If you want to see a real scam visit any yacht club on the east coast and ask them about the write-offs on their yachts.
spelchek 11 months ago
morus - Did you forget about Romneycare? You know, the one Obama molded his policy after and other dems like to throw in republican's faces? The policy you and your ilk suggest will help the poor. Bring some facts to the table before opening your mouth, politics is a discussion for adults.
dokeus6 11 months ago
Excellent Post!!
spelchek 11 months ago
If lies are excellent, I suppose you're right.
dokeus6 11 months ago
What part of viktorkowski's post is a lie?
asb 11 months ago
There are no lies in that post, it is an excellent expression of our present reality. The FRight are convincing millions of American that it's OK for our wealth to be moved from the middle class to the upper class at historic rates and that any attempts to slow that transfer are leftist un-American efforts to stop a natural and healthy process. This is the lie, not what Viktorkowski said so well.
Sequoia 11 months ago
I think some people are missing a couple basic points about capitalism.
Read "Wealth of Nations." (Better yet, just do what I did and read the Cliff notes).
The two basic points we need to remember are:
1) In a perfect capitalist system, the goal is monopoly. All competitors try to snuff out each other so that consumers have no choice. That makes sense, right? So, pure capitalism is not a large market full of actors competing on an equal footing... pure capitalism is the opposite of that. That's why Teddy Roosevelt had to bust the trusts. REGULATED capitalism, like we have in the U.S., is what produces competative markets.
2) In a perfect capitalist system, wages go to subsistence level. Look at a corporate balance sheet. "Labor costs" are a liability, not an asset. The reason we have a middle class with wages above subsistence (basic survival) is because of regulated capitalism.
Capitalism is our engine. "Socialism," if you want to call it that, or regulation, is our brakes and steering wheel.
If you work for wages, or if your business depends on customers who work for wages, you don't want pure capitalism.
Some of you seem to be saying that if we just had more pure capitalism, we'd have more "trickle down." There is absolutely no evidence for this, and tons of evidence to the contrary. There is a REASON we have been moving to regulated capitalism. There is a REASON why there is no pure capitalist nation on earth. If we have less regulated capitalism, we have less trickle down. Why do you think anything trickles down? Because the owners think it is the right thing to do? You think if they get more profits they'll just let more trickle down to be NICE?
My problem with the conservative movement is that it insists on a dramatic, radical (which is not conservative) shift toward more pure capitalism, without ANY explanation of how to address the problems we had that CAUSED us to move to a more regulated system.
That's not conservative. It is reactionary. It is de-stabilizing and reckless. That's not conservative.
I don't drive a car with just an engine and no steering wheel. Why would we live in an economy like that?
asb 11 months ago
But well said nevertheless. The reactionary approach that has hijacked the republican party and outshouted traditional conservatives are actually the forerunners of true facism, and are the enemies of American business in the medium and long term.
GrumpyGus 11 months ago
I am perfectly fine with the existence of a food stamp program. If we could get the feds finger out of the economy and get more people to work with better jobs and better pay, coupled with getting the truly undeserving off the food stamp program, think of what could be done with the balance of that $80 billion that we wouldn't have to use. Pay down debt, improve roads and bridges, improve the grid, create an even better economy! Then what, more growth, more jobs...etc.
GrumpyGus 11 months ago
Those who game the system. If you deny there are those who game the system, I can't reply to you again because you are not operating in the realm of reality.
spelchek 11 months ago
Or when one of the richest senators in the nation tries to harbor his new multimillion dollar lot out side of his home state to avoid the higher taxes he loves everyone else to pay. Kerry would have done nothing wrong legally; but messed up royally from a political stand point. Point being, loop holes exist, people like Kerry legislated them. Blaming rich people doesn't solve anything. Nobody is stopping your from making billions and changing the world through your influence.
Sequoia 11 months ago
Well, the point is that loop holes are bad, right? They're unfair, they're forms of welfare, regardless of how they got there or who takes advantage of them. I wouldn't say I "blame" the very wealthy for tilting the pinball machine. That's just them acting in their self-interest. But, on the other hand, I don't blame the rest of us for wanting our politicians to close them. That's our self-interest.
So, instead of saying, "Just go make a billion dollars, then YOU can take advantage of these unfair loopholes, too," which is a total cop-out, I think the correct position is "Close the loopholes."
Sequoia 11 months ago
Yes, even thought that loophole benefits me. I'm actually with Grace on this one. Simplify the tax code, cut out the loopholes, don't let the powerful game the system to get special handouts. And I agree that closing the loopholes for the powerful minority might allow for reduced tax rates for the majority.
Grace will probably disagree with my view that the more wealth you have, the more taxes you should pay, because protecting individual weatlh actually consumes a lot of government resources.
But, I'm perfectly willing to give up MY loophole, if it means a system that is more fair, stable and effective.
Sequoia 11 months ago
I mean, I didn't buy a house to get the tax deduction. If I did, that would be a bad reason to buy a house. The tax deduction is a perk I didn't think about, and that I don't need. It's nice, but it wasn't a significant incentive for me to buy. It did not figure into my calculation about the amount of house I could afford.
asb 11 months ago
Loopholes are a type of welfare, which is a legitimate process for any civilization. Tax rates mean nothing, it's the final remittance that counts. Our tax revenues relative to GDP are the lowest they've been in decades and are why our debt service continues to climb.
GrumpyGus 11 months ago
Source please...
Sequoia 11 months ago
It's true, Gus. We are living in times of very low taxes. You could do a little research work yourself, but...
here is a source: The Atlantic Montly... no partisan rag, that. I encourage everyone to read the Atlantic. It is a great source.
theatlantic.com/business/archive/2011/12/president-obama-historys-worst-socialist/250051/
I'll cut and paste some parts for you:
"But when it comes to tax policy and redistribution, a not-insignificant part of modern democratic socialism, it's fair to say that President Obama is in the running for worst socialist in history. Rather than raise taxes, he has inherited the lowest tax rates in a generation ... and lowered them repeatedly while presiding over a period of exacerbating income inequality and a stupendous wealth comeback on Wall Street."
"To date, the "socialist" White House has presided over the lightest overall tax burden in half a century."
online_editor 11 months ago
I removed some comments which didn't relate to the topic of food stamps. When an impasse is reached, it's okay to agree to disagree and move on at the point where your points are clear to most folks reading them, rather than continue with personal bickering. Thanks. --Rick Brown, online editor, News Tribune
online_editor 11 months ago
If there's a post we fail to remove because it insults another participant directly, help us out by hitting the remove link and reporting it. Sometimes it's an obvious insult like one I removed that called your screen name morun; sometimes it's borderline and a judgment call. However, a post with an opinion that you don't like or from a person whose views you don't like does not qualify as a personal insult to another participant. If you post the first personal insult in response to a post you don't like that didn't contain a personal insult directed to you, that's problematic. Again, sometimes the slide is gradual, not completely clear cut. Nevertheless, our aim is to encourage posts that focus on issues, not personal insults or off-topic bickering among a small group of participants. Should the latter dominate the discussion, we feel fewer people will want to join in. Hope that helps.
tonto_goldberg 11 months ago
You posted: "if there's a post we fail to remove....we feel fewer people will want to join in." Please try to think in terms of hundreds of posts that should have been removed.
I am going to add to the comment from morus. I do not believe your answer to that comment was adequate. Rather, it seemed to be an effort to dismiss the poster as thin-skinned. I have a thick skin but I have gotten tired of this mess. I mark a few of the more egregious posts for deletion every week or so, and once in a while one will actually get deleted.
I do not believe the newspaper's response to personal and group invective by certain posters has been adequate. You need to do more to encourage civil discussion. Graceful is only the most prolific, most consistent, and most wordy of the offenders. My initial suspicion was that Graceful was a News Tribune employee because of the long-term tolerance of that poster's diatribes against other contributors.
Just to clarify my example, Graceful's habitual labeling of other contributors and hateful rhetoric against the "target" groups to which the other contributors are assigned meet every reasonable criterion for deletion.
Your response to morus indicates that the organization doesn't do much screening and doesn't recogize or react very well to objectionable material.
Thanks, and have a nice day.
tonto_goldberg 10 months, 4 weeks ago
You've finally surprised me with, of all things, whining. You couldn't even do that without typecasting. Somehow, you imagine that anything and anybody who disagres with you is a far-out leftist. That's why you foresee America's future the way you do. The world of ideas and the democratic process include a lot more than you can imagine.
Now, think this through. The News Tribune is a conservative newspaper serving a conservative community. If the newspaper was to adopt viewpoint censorship - which I would oppose - it is the left which would lose ground.
Sequoia 11 months ago
The Atlantic Montly is not "liberal" (except in the sense that it is anti-totalitarian and in favor of diverse viewpoints, which is what "liberal" really means. We're all liberals in that sense.) ANYWAY, the Atlantic has been publishing for over 150 years, long before the conservative movement turned "liberal" into some kind of dirty word.
A real lawyer wouldn't go the judge and say "Your honor, everything my opponent said is just a bunch of liberal stuff. I rest my case."
Not a winning laywer, anyway.
Littleinvestor 11 months ago
I'm no Romney fan but Graceful is right. There are people in the horse "business" just as I was years ago and I wrote plenty of them off, depreciated them, took loses on some and paid income taxes on the profitable ones. Although I am not talented enough for dressage, I'm getting tired of hearing about Mrs. Romney's horse. Plenty of people will tell you that horseback riding helps MS, and other patients. It increases leg strength and balance, both of which she seems to need help with. I'm back on the horse after my accident, even though ol' paint has to put up with me mounting from the "wrong" side since my near side leg was shattered and is still weak.
asb 11 months ago
Anybody who's owned as many horses as you can do dressage at some level. For those wondering, dressage is the schooling of horses and riders in the full range of natural movements of horses as refined for individual and group cavalry movements. The happiest horse in the world is a crazed dancer who knows exactly what its rider wishes to do next. The rider is giving the horse the same hints and instruction as a herd mate. Watch the olympics this August, and ignore the fancy costumes but watch the dance. And yes, Mitt has the wherewithall to invest in dressage horses as a business for which he can write off many costs; while his barn managers, stable hands and day-to-day trainers get paid peanuts and are taxed at 25% rather than Mitt's 15%.
tonto_goldberg 11 months ago
Graceful, if corporations are people they ought to pay taxes. Wouldn't that be logical?
Littleinvestor 11 months ago
I don't know asb. My working cow horses were pretty happy. And I was my own stable hand most of the time. I used outside trainers to ride the young ones a month or so, and they were not cheap. I think the Romney horses are boarded at a facility owned by a college friend of Mrs. Romney so the stable hands may be immigrants or other low paid people.
asb 11 months ago
I'd include roping and cutting horses with dressage horses as far as their relationships and joy at work.
asb 11 months ago
No they are not abused any more than cats or dogs. Some consider race horses, or bucking horses as abused, but dressage horses are among the least abused of any horses. If a dressage horse is abused it is through neglect, not through training or use in dressage, it wouldn't make any sense to be deliberately abusive to an animal that you want to see you as part of themselves. You may be thinking of the prancing warmbloods which are pushed to an extreme version of their natural gait, but not your typical dressage horse. You are misinformed. And, are we a bit off-topic?
Sequoia 11 months ago
There is nothing wrong with dressage. It is one of the more humane horse sports.
Morus, you're doing the thing I criticize the conservative movement for... discrediting your legitimate points by going too far.
Romney may be a vacuous plutocrat, but that doesn't mean that every single thing he's remotely associated with is evil.
asb 10 months, 4 weeks ago
The rollkur forced neck flexing/bending controversy you're linking to is cruel when done as forcefully and for as long as was videotaped. I hadn't seen this video before but am familiar with rollkur. It is not a traditional dressage technique, it alienates the horse, and accomplishes very little beyond appearances. It is done for show, and is wrong. There are riding and reining techniques that encourage a horse into a natural show-off neck arch (stallions do it in their sleep) but Dressage itself is not abusive or cruel. What people at the highest levels of any sport, or even the meat industry will do to animals or themselves to make everything just so or to get an extra half percent profitis endemic to all sport and farming when consideration of the animal is removed. If you read several of the links your suggested phrase finds in Google, you'll note that the public, the animal rights world, and most folks in the dressage world are adamently against training with the excessive methods you're rightly concerned about. It's amazing what a little video can do to call out cruelity and the numbness of some souls who make a living, profitable or slave wage, exploiting animals, and here in Missouri the AgCorp folk are trying to make such controls on human behavior illegal. Does that seem right?
online_editor 10 months, 4 weeks ago
Now that a few days have elapsed for numerous contributors to post their opinions, we'll close commenting on this page. Thanks to those who posted.
Commenting has been disabled for this item.