New exhibit explores Jefferson’s slave ownership
Shannon Lanier points to the pictures on the cover of the book Jefferson's Children, Wednesday, Jan. 25, 2012, at the Smithsonian's National Museum of American History in Washington, Wednesday, Jan. 25, 2012, at a new exhibit: “Slavery at Jefferson’s Monticello: Paradox of Liberty”. Lanier is a descendant of Thomas Jefferson's slave Sally Hemings. Photo by The Associated Press.
Thursday, January 26, 2012
WASHINGTON (AP) — Thomas Jefferson wrote "all men are created equal" to declare U.S. independence from Britain, yet he was also a lifelong slave owner who freed only nine of his more than 600 slaves during his lifetime.
This June 9, 2008 image provided by the Monticello Foundation shows the home of Thomas Jefferson in Charlottesville, Va. Several new projects launching this winter will shed light on the slaves who lived and worked at Monticello.
That contradiction between ideals and reality is at the center of a new exhibit opening Friday as the Smithsonian Institution continues developing a national black history museum. It offers a look at Jefferson's Monticello plantation in Virginia through the lives of six slave families and artifacts unearthed from where they lived.
The exhibit, "Slavery at Jefferson's Monticello: Paradox of Liberty," was developed with Monticello and will be on view at the National Museum of American History through mid-October. It includes a look at the family of Sally Hemings, a slave. Most historians now believe she had an intimate relationship with the third president and that he fathered her children.
Museum Director Lonnie Bunch said his staff can test ideas by building exhibits before the National Museum of African American History and Culture is finished.
It will be the first museum added to the National Mall since 2004. A groundbreaking is planned for Feb. 22, and it's scheduled to open in 2015 near the Washington Monument.
Bunch said museum officials want to see how the public responds to subjects, such as slavery, as they try to present history for the widest possible audience.
Slavery, he said, is still the "last great unmentionable" in public discourse but central in shaping American history.
"This is a story we know we have to tell, and this is a story we know is going to be difficult and going to be challenging, but this new museum has to tell the story," he told The Associated Press. "In many ways, the Smithsonian is the great legitimizer, so if we can wrestle with slavery and Jefferson, other people can."
A portion of the exhibit devoted to the Hemings-Jefferson story marks the first time the subject has been presented on the National Mall.
Curators stopped short of making a definitive statement in the exhibit about the relationship, but they wrote that it was likely an intimate one, based on documentary and genetic evidence.
"On the one hand it's not a breakthrough for scholars. We've known this for a long time," Bunch said. "I think that the public is still trying to understand it."
Many artifacts, including tools and kitchen ceramics, are on public view for the first time, exploring the work and lives of slave families who lived on Jefferson's plantation. Among the pieces on display is a hand-crafted chair built by John Hemings, Sally Hemings' brother, to replicate a set of French chairs at Monticello.
While such items may have been seen by 450,000 people a year at Monticello, they are accessible to millions of visitors at the Smithsonian, curators said.
In the exhibit, oral histories from descendants of Jefferson's slaves reveal stories passed down through families for generations, along with detailed records kept by Jefferson.
For example, Jefferson bought George and Ursula Granger and their sons as slaves in 1773, and Ursula became a "favorite housewoman" of his wife. Jefferson eventually made George Granger the overseer of Monticello, the only slave to rise to that position and receive an annual wage.
Later, the first baby born in the White House was the son of Wormley and Ursula Hughes, who belonged to Jefferson.
"We can begin to understand slavery, not as an abstraction but through the stories of individuals and families who were surviving within a system that denied their humanity," said Leslie Green Bowman, president of the Thomas Jefferson Foundation that runs Monticello.
A related website will showcase the "Getting Word" oral history project.
Curators also explore the importance of slavery in early U.S. history and Jefferson's views on enslavement, which he called an "abominable crime."
The small laptop portable desk he used to draft the Declaration of Independence is placed front and center in the exhibit, borrowed from the Smithsonian's permanent presidential gallery.
Shannon Lanier, 32, of New York City, a ninth generation descendant of Jefferson and Hemings through their son Madison Hemings, said he has known about his ancestors for years from stories told by his mother and grandmother.
Having such an exhibit at the Smithsonian is a breakthrough, he said, because it's past time for more people to know about Jefferson's history with slavery.
"This is a great catalyst for conversation," he said, standing near a bronze statue of Jefferson. "It's really hard for people to understand slavery and Thomas Jefferson. He was a president, why couldn't he set them free?"
"This helps enlighten people about ... how complex it was."
Bill Webb of New York City learned only in 2006 that his ancestor Brown Colbert was a slave connected to Monticello as the grandson of Elizabeth Hemings, Sally Hemings' mother — a discovery he called "mind blowing."
"On any research that you do, I think it's exciting. But with slavery, it's certainly disturbing sometimes," he said. "But it's fact. It's good to know from whence one comes."
As for Jefferson, Webb said he was "a product of his time."
Until the mid-1980s, Monticello avoided the difficult topic of slavery. But decades of research and archaeology at the site, along with an oral history project begun in 1993 with descendants of slaves, helped piece together a fuller picture of slave life, said Monticello Curator Elizabeth Chew.
"Twenty years ago, we could not have done this show," she said.
Smithsonian Curator Rex Ellis said understanding Jefferson's place in history requires a deeper understanding of his entanglement with 607 enslaved men, women and children.
"We have to give voice to them," Ellis said. "They represent the community who brought him to his father on a pillow when he was born to those who adjusted the pillow under his head when he died."
National Museum of African American History and Culture: http://nmaahc.si.edu/
Monticello: http://www.monticello.org/



Comments
wow 1 year, 4 months ago
This is certainly a contradiction of human/American values, hypocracy at it's greatest level and also exactly what I've pointed out in the past. But before I continue....I hope the comments which follow are provided in a effort for us all to learn and certainly to improve the situation which we all have inherited. Will the ghost's haunt or help us?
Jefferson wasn't the only founding father who spoke this "freedom from tyranny" stuff, yet at the same time denying people basic freedoms. I've often heard it said that this occurred because of the times and that the wording of the United States Constitution indicated that these leaders knew freedom for all was inevitable; however they were unsure how to make it happen sooner. Well perhaps one of the ways to make it happen sooner than centuries after these racial horrors destroyed so many innocent lives was simply to lead by example. All Mr. Jefferson, Adams, Washington and other's simply had to do was free their slaves and demand that the other slave owners do the same. We all know that didn't happen and as of yet there hasn't been an acceptable answer given as to why. As for the terrible stuff that followed...there is certainly no justifiable reason for the horrors caused by years of Jim Crow, Black Codes, segregation and pure racial hate. These American leaders and the American citizens had more than enough opportunity to right this wrong. Yet the majority choose to do nothing. Again there is no rational answer for that to have occurred.
So here we are in 2012 and Shannon Lanier ponders with the question his ancestors pondered. Why was this behavior allowed for so long? Regretfully Shannon, like his ancestors may never hear a reasonable answer. Regretfully back in the day Shannon's ancestors had to deal with views like that of a well known American politician of that time, who proudly scoffed that "there was no right a black person had that a white person had to respect"...even worse the United States Supreme Court agreed with that view. Now today, even though the supreme Court has been partially corrected and the majority of American's have come to their senses...still Shannon like his ancestors may still never find the answers he seeks, because there are folks who cannot enagage in meaningful conversation about the history of this nation. Also there is that modern day group of people who feel this young man and many others like him should just get over what occurred. There is also a troubling number of Americans who want things returned to the pre segragation era.
I'm with Shannon...I'd like an answer...once that answer is brought to light, then we may be able to prevent it from occurring again and take huge step to promoting racial harmony.
Shannon...get your learn on and keep pushing for the truth.
NT...you've been providing some very good dicussion opportunities of late.... Good job.
wow 1 year, 4 months ago
Some people do bad things....yeah....tell that to the Georgia folks who are trying to keep Obama from running for President in the Peach state. Something to do with him not providing a valid birth certifcate. I believe at least one of the persons of influence who are "part of get the rid of the Black President movement" is a sitting Judge. A new form of Poll Tax, Voter registartion requirement...what?
As for if John Adams owned slaves...well since I wasn't there I can't be 100% sure of the true answer. But certainly like most rich people of the times...I would not be surprised if he were a slave owner. Fact is there were many of the colonial leaders who did own slaves...some of which I didn't name. Nonetheless I'm not concerned with naming every slave owner, nor am I really keying in on the issue of slavery. For I don't think any rational person can/will defend such an evil. Nor do I believe the issue is as simple as "people do bad things". I think it's much more than that....I say that because, it was OUR AMERICAN LEADERS who were so determined to build a government that championed freedom which allowed the evils to happen then and to cary on for centuries afterward. Are you saying those leaders were bad people. If that's the case why are they celebrated today as heroe's? If it was as simple as you state...would not a simple apology from a person of influence be warranted? Graceful your answer creates contradictions and lead to more unanswered questions.
Man, all of that and we have yet to get to what I feel is the more important issue. THE POST SLAVERY era......if all you can say about the slavery issue is "some people do bad things"...then sir/mam, Mr. Shannon myself and other's are still looking for an acceptable answer. Also I'm interested to learn what your reasoning will be for what AMERICAN LEADERS allowed to follow for centuries after slavery was over.
Graceful...good conversation so far....and honestly speaking I'm not trying to argue......but I am trying to generate open dialouge on the very sensitive issue of the undiscussed hypocracy of America and Americans.
Gabrielle 1 year, 4 months ago
wow: Graceful offered perspective. I firmlly believe there is nothing anyone can say or do to make this atrocity 'right' for you, for anyone alive today, for anyone who suffered any sort of injustice b/c of s-----y, j---c--w, p--- --x, s---------n, or anything remotely related to all of this. There is no money that can be paid to make up for anything that has happened. To even attempt 'reparations' actually borders on an insult to those who were s----s. Give them some dignity. People, inculding me, have offered you what we have. It isn't enough. Is it right to expect something from someone when they don't have what you want? I think not. At the risk of giving you food for argument, I sometimes wonder what an enslaved person from that part of American history would say to you today. Each time I wonder, I imagine you being told how wonderful you have it today. You are free! You are free! FREE AT LAST! FREE AT LAST!! FREE AT LAST!!
What I will do: I will hold out hope for you - as I stated in a previous post. I will do my best to be patient as you - and others - get this out of your systems. Please feel free to post and express whatever it is you have to say about this for as long as you so desire. And I will do my best not to kick myself for saying this!
This museum offers much healing to many people whose ancestors mistreated during that time. I may visit it next time I am at the Smithsonian.
JCLifer 1 year, 4 months ago
A slave from the past would say "Get over it. We were the ones who suffered. You are just whining and making excuses, You have every opportunity- take them, get to work, and quit whining."
kentheco 1 year, 4 months ago
Will we ever put this controversy to rest? We cannot change history, only learn from the mistakes. We "U.S.A." took land away from the Native Americans (or were they Asians) and put them on reservations. Then we “U.S.A.” forced them to move when valuable natural resources were found on their land; then we “U.S.A.” brought slaves to work the land; and after all this, we "U.S.A." forced the imprisonment and theft of property from Japanese Americans during World War II. How about we send everyone back to where their ancestors came from and give the land back to the true owners.
wow 1 year, 4 months ago
I think we are understanding that this is "STILL" a very complicated issue. When people talk about racisim, yes there are some who only wish to be negative and beat the war drums...but then there are some who simply wish to discuss the issue seeking answers as to why another human would enslave another. Some people only want to determine why America/Americans...the bright light of freedom for so many would allow systems like Jim Crow, Segregation and such to fester for so long. Some would ask why slave owning leaders/political types are accepterd as champions for good, yet people like Geronimo, Malcom X, John Brown and others are despised as evil men who committed crimes against innocent people? Were these men not victims of the brutal, unfair, illegal Amercan system of racism? Were these men not fighting for their God given right of indepedence? Let's not forget these men were not asking for sucession from the nation, they were simply asking to be free and treated fairly by the nation in which they lived. Why is that Confederate Soldiers have a right to succedd from the union, but a man does not have the right to fight for his freedom from the chains of chattel bondgae? This generation may never hear an acceptable answwer...but one thing for sure is "some people do bad things" isnt the answer which past, present or future generations will accept either. Petunia I don't agree with you on many things but your question "what would an enslaved person from that part of American history would say to today?" is a good one. But here's a possible answer....America did wrong, it's a well know fact. But why did they continue to do wrong afterwards? Some people just want to discuss, learn and help to end a long standing probem.
Also...I don't think the all people who discuss this issue want pitty, I certainly don't. But I/many others don't want you to continue kicking the can down the road telling me/other's to get over it either. Discussing this issue is an oppotunity to learn and continue the healing process....because like it or not, past racism has hurt a lot of people AND BECASUE "JUST GET OVER IT ATTITUDES" DIDN'T PROPERLY ADDRESS THE PROBLEM THEN. RACSIM IS STILL HURTING PEOPLE TODAY. If you have nothing to provide which could help, that's fine.. But please don't compound the problem by looking the other way and acting as if everything is alright. We've had far to mauch of that already, which is why RACISM is still a big problem today!
JCLifer 1 year, 4 months ago
Racism is a big problem today because of voluntarily chosen behaviors. Act different than the norm- expect to be treated different that the norm. Stereotyping is not right, but humans like to put things into neat little categories. Learning is slow, but it doesn't occur when the negative behaviors keep reinforcing the stereotypes.
Gabrielle 1 year, 4 months ago
wow: why do you say 'RACISM is still a big problem today!'?
Gabrielle 1 year, 4 months ago
That is what I see, too. There was a time I would've thought otherwise. IT may be that some use it as a political tool and others who believe it to be.
spelchek 1 year, 4 months ago
I do not feel bad about slavery because I have never partook in the act of owning a slave nor has anyone I have ever known. People I associate with live in the present and judge people via behavior and character. People I associate with look forward, not backwards like some on here with huge chips on their shoulders. I see many successful black Americans today which is the indicator I use to measure progress, not something that happened two hundred years ago. If we are going to memorialize mistakes of the past, then lets be consistent and start flying the confederate flags at historic sites attempting to do the same thing as this new waste of tax dollars.
JCLifer 1 year, 4 months ago
Excellent post. I feel exactly the same way.
I do support paying restitution to all currently living slaves, but not their decendants, though.
Slavery is over many years ago in this country. Time to move on. There is nothing left to discuss. It is over.
wow 1 year, 4 months ago
The Gov of New Jersey suggest that the passage the Civil Rights Act should've been voted on by the people. However the people the Civil Rights act was suppose to help werr not allowed to vote...so Mr Christy what are ya saying Bub? Genrich...says English should be the language of America and not some Ghetto derivative....Ghetto derivative? People saying if they could, they'd change the outcome of the Civil War. With comments like this floating around, HTFF can anyone think or suggest that racism/stupidity is a thing of the past?
Sequoia 1 year, 4 months ago
Slaveholders who see themselves as oppressed. The sick, pathetic irony of the confederate cause.
Those who loudly proclaim their own morality are lying to themselves, to others, or both. If I turn a blind eye to my own darkness, it will dominate every move I make, every word I speak. The best any of us can do in this life is beg for mercy.
Gabrielle 1 year, 4 months ago
Have you and Graceful had the 'states rights discussion' on this? If so, refresh my memory which thread that was and I will gladly reread it. If not, I would like to read that dialogue between the two of you.
Sequoia 1 year, 4 months ago
My faith teaches that we are fallen creatures. We are animals who can know the good, and strive toward the good, but we're not perfect. Racism, and all forms of hate, anger, violence, prejudice live in that imperfection. That's why we have to be careful.
Sequoia 1 year, 4 months ago
Racism, sexism, religious, ethnic and national prejudice, fear of people outside the group... these things are part of the fallen human nature. They will disappear when there are no more human beings on the earth. All these evil things are alive and well in the hearts of every single human being. That means you and me.
Gabrielle 1 year, 4 months ago
Sequoia: it seems you see 'Racism alive and well in the hearts of every single human being'. Where EXACTLY do you identify racism? To this point, wow hasn't answered a similar question previously asked in this thread. I would like to hear from you - or anyone who identifies with your statement above. thanks.
Sequoia 1 year, 4 months ago
Petunia, I'll think about this. Usually I like to spout off at the drop of a hat, but race is one of those things I don't think that much about. That's a luxury I have as a white person in America... I don't HAVE to think about race very much. Wherever I go... the store, the classroom, work, etc... most everyone there is white. Most everyone looks just like me. I'm very rarely in a situation where I'm in the minority. I can't remember the last time I looked around and said "Hey, I'm the only white person here." That's the privilege of being in the majority group. You don't have to worry or think about being different.
That's what gets me about some of these people who say racism no longer exists, or that race doesn't matter. Go spend a year somewhere where YOU'RE in the minority, then come back and tell me race doesn't matter. Or just wait a few years until whites are no longer the majority in this country. I wonder if they'll start "seeing racism" then.
BTW, I'm no expert on the Civil War. Here is a link to the Declaration of Causes of Secession drafted by some of the confederate states. Looks to me like it was about "states' rights" to hold African slaves as property. But you can read for yourself why they wanted to leave the union.
sunsite.utk.edu/civil-war/reasons.html
Gabrielle 1 year, 4 months ago
Sequioa: to make the statement: racism is 'alive and well in the hearts of every single human being. That means you and me.' would indicate you had something in mind when you wrote this. It is unclear to me why it is something that is 'alive and well' AND, when asked to specifically identify it, it is time to think. It just doesn't make sense to me.
Two requests: 1. Sure would like some clarification on the above.
2.Have you been 'in the minority' somewhere?
Sequoia 1 year, 4 months ago
The Constitution said black people were three fifths of a person. That was not much more than 200 years ago. We fought a brutal war over whether the phrase "all men are created equal" applied to black people. That was less than 200 years ago. When we tried to put that phrase into law with the Civil Rights Acts, it was met with fierce resistance. That was 50 years ago. And, as it has been pointed out before, the North and the white liberals were not paragons of virtue at any of these times. Do you really think the human heart has changed since then, even if we don't say certain words out loud any more?
Racism isn't just about one person hating another person. To me, it has to do with the structure of our society, about the history of many individual decisions that put that structure in place. Racism isn't just about hate. It is about POWER.
When I heard the crowd roar for Newt Gingrich at the South Carolina debate, I heard racism. When people freaked out about "the Ground Zero mosque" in New York City, I heard racism. When I hear about Ron Paul's racist newsletters, I see racism. When a black person gets a much longer prison sentence for crack than a white person gets for cocaine, I see racism. When I read about police "stop and frisk" procedures that seem to only happen in minority neighborhoods, I see racism.
When I read about police who behave like this, I see racism: theatlantic.com/national/archive/2012/01/everything-sunny-all-the-time-always/251958/
If I walk through a ghetto, most of the faces I see are dark. If I walk into a college classroom or a corporate board room, most of the faces I see are white. That's racism. Not necessarily because any of those white faces are consciously acting to exclude others out of a conscious sense of hatred, but just that the fact speaks for itself about the society we live in.
I'm not saying that the preponderance of dark faces in ghettos or prisons mean that those people are "victims" of some specific act of racism, or that their individual decisions aren't the reason for their place in society. I'm saying that those individual decisions are made in the context of a social structure that has a specific history, and as a white person it is much easier to miss that context and see only the individual decisions.
I've never been in the minority for an extended period of time. To me, the fact that I as a white person don't really need to think about race is a part of racism.
I'm sure I'll catch heck for all of this, but you asked me what I thought.
Gabrielle 1 year, 4 months ago
Unsure from where or who you would 'catch heck'. I appreciate your response. Of course, there is a history that a group of people are coming out of. What is the connection between this group of people and the circumstances that you outline? We all have minds and make choices. How does that fit into all this? It seems that the facts you outline are based on a myth that 'race' exists. Why not do this with .....eye color.....or ear lobes? To me, it looks like you are buying into the myth of 'race'. As long as you continue to think that way, 'racism' as you have idenitfied it in the most recent post exists. I suggest to you, you are part of the problem. It is important to be observant as you are. It is the interpretation of what you are seeing that is part of perpetuating the problem. I, too, used to call it 'racism'. NO MORE! There are reasons you and I and others see what we see - that is where the solution lies. Understanding this. Many people are doing things that make a difference. This is good. Your thoughts?
Sequoia 1 year, 4 months ago
I understand the idea that, biologically, race doesn't exist. What I'm saying is that we live in a country founded on the idea that a person with black skin (not blue eyes or ear lobes) was property, and less than a whole person. This is why we're not having this discussion about eye color.
And another point is that, sure, it is easy for us to sit here and say "race doesn't exist." But that's part of the privilege we have as the majority, because we are never in situations where we notice the color of our skin and feel self-conscious about being different.
Why don't you take your theory into a minority neighborhood. Every time you see a brown-skinned male pushed up against the wall by police and randomly searched, just go up to him afterward and remind him not to buy into the myth that "race" exists. I'm sure he'll realize that he's part of the problem, and thank you for your insight.
Gabrielle 1 year, 4 months ago
And what will your suggestion accomplish? Theory???? What 'faith' taught you about 'racism'? Consider The Truth? What is The Truth here? What does the past have to do with now? Why is it the 3/5 is relevant today? Everyone has the same opportunities in this country - INCLUDING EVERYONE.....
Gabrielle 1 year, 4 months ago
I remember - a couple of years ago there was legislation to do away with affirmative action. Its a must. It is necessary. thanks, Graceful. What is so odd about this whole thing is - it isn't 'blacks' and some 'whites' who think 'racism is alive and well. There are just as many people from these groups who say pretty much the opposite. Stop the victim stuff - get to wrk - educate yourself.....etc...... Its definately not down 'racial' lines.......its just the oddest thing. I once heard a woman who identified herself as 'black' say she is actually afraid for 'white' people in the future. I wish people would wake up - stop 'celebrating diversity and Dr. King and do what he said - judge people by their character. Its actually quite sad. Children really believe they are doomed b/c that is what they hear people say. ....how unfair the world is..... in alot of ways, this is one of the best places to be living. I wish they would see this. ,,,,,NOW!
Gabrielle 1 year, 4 months ago
Sequoia: still thinking? Are you really interpretting things correctly?
Gabrielle 1 year, 4 months ago
Sequioa: 'When I heard the crowd roar for Newt Gingrich at the South Carolina debate, I heard racism. When people freaked out about "the Ground Zero mosque" in New York City, I heard racism. When I hear about Ron Paul's racist newsletters, I see racism. When a black person gets a much longer prison sentence for crack than a white person gets for cocaine, I see racism. When I read about police "stop and frisk" procedures that seem to only happen in minority neighborhoods, I see racism.'
Do you ever ask yourself what is going on? Why do you immediately think, hear, see 'racism'? I dare say, you think about 'race' more than you claim you do - white or otherwise.
eileen10 1 year, 4 months ago
I was born and raised in northern Minnesota.I didnt see a black person until I was 18 years old but to me a person of different colored skin was no different than me.I didnt have the feelings of racial difference.When I moved to Texas which was job related I was thrown into a completley different world.A world where many blacks wanted nothing to do with me simply because I was white and it was very difficult for me to even begin to understand that.As time went on I saw and felt the invisible wall that was between me and people of a different race. racism isnt something we're born with.In school I was taught that the civil war was about slavery and that Betsy Ross made the flag.What Im trying to say is that weare taught what to think and feel by other people such as teachers,parents and even friends.As youngsters were like a sponge and what we learn generally stays with us.The cycle will only be broken when people begin to think and feel differently and thats very hard to do when hate is involved.Not just hate but the feelings of the skin color issue be it blacks.chinese etc.To this day I dont see an answer to the wall that seperates the different races.It wont happen until all people change things which means parents letting their children know that we are all the same.And thats a good beginning. I dont know what the world will be like in 500 years.Better I hope.I dont think that all people put up a wall. Maybe it depends on where a person lives.
Gabrielle 1 year, 4 months ago
THank you, eileen10. I sure appreciate the opportunity to read your comments.
wow 1 year, 4 months ago
Thanks for the good comments...the discussion is on going and that is a plus. Until more of that happens...progress on this issue will most certainly be slow and most likely won't resolve a thing for the better.
Petunia...what is it you want me to answer? I've tried answering your earlier questions, but it seems as if my repsonses are not what you want....I can't help that. Also read on...I'm not the only one who understand's, admits and confront's the racism which is seen/experienced everyday. Thanks to Eileen and Sequoia for being straight up and pointing out that I'm not screaming just because. Both of your comments describe situations where racism was an issue. I like the idea that none of us are suppoter's of racism, no matter who the victim or offender is...but we're also not acting like it doesn't exist ether. In my opinion that is one way to help erradicate this vile evil. But regretfully so many people have sat silent for far to long...thus racism has gone unchecked/unchallenged for centuries before the Civil War, after the Civil War and most certainly after the Civil Rights act was signed. Although racism isn't an issue 100% of the time. It is not a thing of the past..."just because America has a black President". If we're going to end racism.."ism's" in general, we've got a lot of work to do....and adopting a "just get over it" attitude won't do.
Gabrielle 1 year, 4 months ago
a repeat just for you - from previous post: wow: why do you say 'RACISM is still a big problem today!'? Do explain it EXACTLY what you see that you are calling racism?
JCLifer 1 year, 4 months ago
Anytime you mention a person's race, you have racism. NAACP, Obama being first black president, crackers, etc. All of these are racist. You cannot avoid racism anymore than you can avoid daylight and nighttime. Just because it is racism doesn't mean it is bad. Some folks just want to keep playing the victim, even when the crime was committed 150 years ago.
Gabrielle 1 year, 4 months ago
JCLifer: I interpret that you are answering from wow's perspective. Is this correct? Also, what do you mean when you say: 'just because it is racism doesn't mean it is bad.'? I haven't a clue on that.
JCLifer 1 year, 4 months ago
Talking about race is not necessarily a good or a bad thing. It just is what it is. Same for catagegorizing people or talking about their differences.
Some tolks think we should not talk about such things. It might be bad.
Gabrielle 1 year, 4 months ago
I think I understand what you are saying. I just think of the children who grow up around this talk. Its really an adult issue - not met for childen's ears b/c when their environment makes false statements/accusations due to inaccurate interpretations of the world, it colors theirs falsely. I would like children - all children to know the world to be a wonderful place. This country is one of the best places to live. AND - in a lot of ways, we live in a wonderful time. I know, I am very glad to be here now. Thanks, JCLifer.
wow 1 year, 4 months ago
Most recently the Gov of New Jersey suggested that the passage of the Civil Rights Act should've been voted on by the people. However the people the Civil Rights act was suppose to help were not allowed to vote at that time. Which means there would have been no passage of the Civil Rights legislation. Was the Gov's comment made out of ignorance racism or what?
People saying if they could, they'd change the outcome of the Civil War. Why would anyone want to change the outcome of the Civil War except to still shackel people of color to the system of slavery/racism? With comments like that floating around, how can you or anyone suggest that racism/stupidity is a thing of the past?
Today's racism is covert...conatined in phrases like 1st Black whatever or I'm not a racist becasue I have whatever color friends. Phrases like like Welfare Queens, Foodstamp President or the fact that when illegal immigration is mentioned only Hispanic's are referred to. Statements like, black people need to get a hold of their criminal neighbors to put an end to crime. Since crime and criminals are influenced by all races...would it not be best to comment that PEOPLE need to get a better hold on things in order to get a hold on crime?
In the 21st century American's have elected government officials who've been/are members of racial hate groups..."David Duke" just for starters. We also have elected officials trying to restrict/deny the right to vote to citizens who these elected offcials feel will once agian vote for the "black guy".....although I agree, with having an ID...there is no rational reason for a person to be forced into gettting a special voters ID when a state Driver's License, Military ID or other government issued Photo ID will do. Unless of course one is trying to influence the election outcome so that the "black guy" doesn't win. Don't just take my situations, read the comments of other's. Get out of your cacoon and venture out into the world. Open your eyes...it's right there for you to see. Again not every case is racism, but there's a lot that are. If you're telling me you've never encountered racism in 2012 or will never see it in the comming days of 2012...Petunia nothing I comment about matters. Petunia...not every issue of ignorance is racially related and there are many people who shout racism when race has nothing to do with the matter. But acting like racism is a thing of the past is either motivated by ignorance or racism. I 'm not saying which one applies to you because only you know that. But if you really want to learn about more cases of modern day racism. Dont take my word, do your own research, the information is available. I guarantee that you will not have to create anything or wait very long...just open you eyes and ears.
Gabrielle 1 year, 4 months ago
You have made my point, wow. How presumptious of you!
JCLifer 1 year, 4 months ago
what problem?
Gabrielle 1 year, 4 months ago
lol - could this be an understatement? ...just a thought, showme.....lol..
wow 1 year, 4 months ago
LClifer...I agree, there are a lot of fales accusations of racism. But there are also a lot of situations where racism is clearly the issue. Just so ya know, there are a lot of people...myself included who feel that if the celebration of the Amercian sytem of racism ended. It might make "just getting over it" much easier to do.
Gabrielle 1 year, 4 months ago
thanks, Graceful.
Gabrielle 1 year, 4 months ago
fortunately I know you are speaking for yourself when you say 'we can only surmise.....' I have read Graceful's posts and see ideas of a specific conservative philosophy expressed. To 'surmise that she is either racist or suffering from some other feelings of inadequacy...' is seen for what it is - nothing to counter in a dialogue of political ideas so make derogatory statements about their person. It is actually more of a reflection of the person making the derogatory statements than of the person the statements are about.
wow 1 year, 4 months ago
If you dislike Obama beacause his policies that's fine...but "when an amphibian like Gingrich can call Obama the "Food Stamp President" and receive cheers of pure jubilation from a crowd many of whom saw and support segregation first-hand, racism is not 'over". Also it's quite obvious I'm not the only one who can see this problem and it's also obvious that there are those who share the "just get over it" attitude.
Yes there are some false complaints, but it's not like people see racism behind every rock...common sense proves that's not the case and I'm glad for that. But regretably..'RACISM" is very much a reality in today's world. And it's that same common sense that proves only a person who doesn't care, doesn't want to face the truth or is a racist themself say's otherwise.
The issue with this original article was trying to understand the hypocracy of the American Founding Father/Thomas Jefferson. That led me to ask why the pre Civil War issues happened, which led me to follow up with why the Post Civil War issues happened? To both questions I was told to get over it by a few. Also someone also feels there's a huge amount of Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahing going on. OK that's your stance cool. Just understand that not everyone shares your shame view.
Graceful if the outcome of the Civil War had been/ended differently, only people of color/poor would be experiencing todays hardships. That might good for you, but it certainly would not be for the opprressed. But since you'd be in the benfitting group it would not matter to you. Is that what your're saying?
Gabrielle 1 year, 4 months ago
this is so kind of you, Graceful, to answer the question - given things that have been said about you. May be one day people will see you for the honest, kind person you are.
Your last sentences 'The south lost the war and took it out on the former slaves. Reconstruction had the opposite affect than was intended.' is often the way it goes - the unintended consequences.
wow 1 year, 4 months ago
I'm watching a special on the US Secret Service and the Presidential Security detail and accoding to their data. Pressident Obama has had more "death threats" made against him than any other President in history. Their figures show a STAGGERING INCREASE OF 400% in Presidential Death Threats towards President Obama. These are the figures of United States Secret Service...not me. The experts also link the extremly large spike in the activity and increasing membership of hates groups (Klan, Aryans, Neo-Nazi's etc, etc,) to the hatred of President Obama. Again this is the Secret Service information. They say this vial racist hatred has nothing to do with President Obama's policies and everything to do with the color of his skin
So ya wanna keep sticking your head in the sand, that's your business. I'm not going to wait until something bad happens before I point out the racist person who is lurking about. I DON'T CARE WHAT RACE THEY ARE. A racist cannot hide near me...cause I will certainly point them out!
Gabrielle 1 year, 4 months ago
anything else you would like to say?
wow 1 year, 4 months ago
The Secret Service has nothing to do with the policies the President approves or disapproves. These are the people in charge of protecting him and his family and it's their intelligence network that has provided the information on the extremly large number of threats to President Obama. Again according to the Secret Service these threats are not policy related...unless you want to accept hating President Obama because he is a black man as normal policy. If that's the case then I'd like to know who's policy that is?
Gabrielle 1 year, 4 months ago
anything else?
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