Our Opinion: Keep focus on key issues for secondary education

Wednesday, December 12, 2012

The future of secondary education in the local public school district is a valuable, if belated, discussion.

Members of Jefferson City’s school board have laid the groundwork for construction of a single, new high school. The board has adopted the academy concept, endorsed the idea of a replacement high school, purchased a site on Mission Drive at Missouri 179 and agreed to sell the existing high school and other facilities.

Separately, but simultaneously, a group of patrons who favor operating two public high schools — a new one as well as the existing one — has gained momentum.

Members of the group “Citizens for 2 Public High Schools” addressed the board at its meeting Monday night. Also speaking were patrons who support the single, new facility.

Both sides advance persuasive arguments. And both have been known to offer lame supporting evidence.

Let’s examine both.

The strongest argument for operating two high schools is student-centered, but perhaps too idealistic.

Two high schools would divide what would be the largest high school population in the state into two separate facilities, which also would double a number of student opportunities.

But operational costs are greater for two facilities, and a patron survey has indicated cost and support are inversely proportional — as projected costs increase, support diminishes.

Proponents of two facilities weaken their argument with hyperbole, as evidenced in these statements: “The public feels we are not being heard” and “Everyone is against one giant high school.” Such statements are neither true nor fair.

The strongest case for a single public high school is grounded in economics and reality.

Supporters are attempting to promote what they believe is the best attainable plan for educational improvement.

They believe the academy concept will mitigate over-crowding by dividing the student population among seven academies.

A tangential argument focuses on fears of inequity between old and new schools. Such concerns are debunked by the public elementary schools, where no link exists between the varied ages of the buildings and educational excellence.

We welcome and encourage discussion about the school district’s future. Avoiding exaggerations and false assumptions will help promote informed, instructive discussion.

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RobHunterJohnson 5 months, 1 week ago

How much will the remodel of JCHS cost? How much would the new second High School cost? How much would the new Acadamy style High School cost, including the 3.1 million for a land already purchased, and the cost of the new Thorpe Gordon elementry which seem to come up in plans? Rob

dokeus6 5 months, 1 week ago

There is the cost of the bond issue and then the cost of the additional personal(7 principals and the staff that they need) on our property tax. A extra three hundred dollars a year may not seem like much to the lawyers, business owners and other elites in this town but it's more than enough on top of what we already pay for JC School tax to put the rest of us in a bind.

mikemojc 5 months, 1 week ago

Also worth noting, How much of a remodel does the current facility 'need'?

Precisely, what is broken that needs to be fixed? If the current problems with the facility are all directly related to student population, those immediately get corrected when 1/2 the students disappear to go to a new facility.

RobHunterJohnson 5 months, 1 week ago

I read in the boards info page that it was 25 million? I too would like a break down on that amount? Rob

JCLifer 5 months, 1 week ago

Are there any examples of towns our size operating one huge mega school with academies? Did the board visit these towns? How do their children perform in such large high schools?

3633 5 months, 1 week ago

Also, how much will it cost to bus kids to the new location?

mikemojc 5 months, 1 week ago

I would think that busing costs would be reduced based on taking kids to only the closer of 2 locations. Think about the reduced busing costs incurred when we went from 7/8th grade downtown to LC and TJ.

RobHunterJohnson 5 months, 1 week ago

JC What I could find on the internet was that if you add the enrollment of the 9th graders, JCHS is about the 70th largest school in the country. I do not remember the site, but I listed it on yesterdays page, the 100th school has an enrollment of 2200, and JCHS including the 9th grades is 2472 + - Rob

JCLifer 5 months, 1 week ago

Cost of running an election that you know will be lost.

RobHunterJohnson 5 months, 1 week ago

JC, I will rephrase my question to backesmarc, you seem to be in the know according to makeSense, so if we go to US high school ranking largest enrollments 2011, the top 100 schools show me that if I were to add in the 9th graders into JCHS, enrollmrent at our school would have a total of 2472? Do you agree with my figure, and if so why are we so large? Rob

3633 5 months, 1 week ago

Now that is reality, where are all these comparisons coming from; those who want one high school. Seems to me we are spending what we don't have and all is based on one persons idea who already purchased the land. Yes, lots of people want to expand but I bet not many of them even have school age kids and can pay the more in taxes. This is going to cost lots of money and we the tax payers will pay it!!!!!

JCneeds2HS 5 months, 1 week ago

JC is No. 1 in school size newstribune.com/news/2012/oct/21/jc-plan-no-1-school-size/

If all Jefferson City high school students were combined on one campus, it would be the largest high school in the state, home to about 2,670 students. That’s what the Jefferson City Board of Education is proposing to do with its plan to build a single, replacement high... school on the land it purchased three weeks ago east of Missouri 179. But by breaking up that campus into smaller learning communities, called academies, the board hopes to address the community’s concerns about such a large high school. Currently, the largest high school in the state is Hazelwood West High with 2,258 students, based on 2012 enrollment data provided by the Missouri Department of Elementary and Secondary Education. Two other high schools in the St. Louis region — Marquette Senior High in Chesterfield and Northwest High in Cedar Hill — follow closely with 2,201 students and 2,120 students, respectively. Jefferson City is ranked 11th on that list with 1,957 students grades 10 through 12. But there’s a caveat: The 711 students currently enrolled at Simonsen 9th Grade Center are not counted in that number. For the other 10 big schools, their ninth grade classes are included in their high school population totals. Which means, by some measures, Jefferson City may already be operating the largest high school in the state. And if the district chooses to build a single new high school that houses all four grades to replace the current campus at 609 Union St., the likelihood is quite high that facility will be the largest in the state — by 410 students. In other words, Jefferson City High School would be 18 percent larger than Hazelwood West, when the ninth grade is combined with upperclassmen. Columbia Public Schools had 5,128 students enrolled in grades 9-12 a year ago, and is in the process of building a new school. Once it is inhabited, the district expects to distribute the students like this: 1,963 at Rock Bridge; 1,987 at Hickman; 1,062 at Battle; and 93 at Douglas. The size of the student population in the Jefferson City School District — foreshadowed by a current baby boom in the lower grades — has recently re-energized the debate about how students ought to be educated, and in what setting. What about a second high school?

Jcneeds2hs.com

sancho 5 months, 1 week ago

I just found some information on the newjchsdotus site that I did not realize was there. Go to that website, click on facilities, and then go to the FAQs (frequently asked questions). If I recall correctly there is a pretty clear explanation of the costs for renovating the existing campus for one school, building a 2nd hs and renovating the existing campus, and building the 7 academy model at the site purchased. I believe they also go into the cost of operating the different models.

If the school board is adding questions and answers to that site, could they add this question: What are examples of current districts that have academies? It would be nice if they listed some districts, and also provided links to the information they presented last fall about the districts with academies that they visited.

dokeus6 5 months, 1 week ago

They could also add some statistics on the before and after performance of the students of those school districts that added academies.

mikemojc 5 months, 1 week ago

hteeteep://w w w.newstribune.com/news/2012/dec/12/your-opinion-survey-reflects-cost-concerns-school-/

Comments disabled. Hmmmm....

While I agree that hyperbole weakens ones statements, so does mixing questions, answers and what they mean. It's basically comparing apples to oranges.

I guess a report to show what the real world costs of a moderate new school (population about 1300, built in a way that allows for future growth) and reasonable remodeling of the current facilities (25 million seems WAY out of line with no evidence of structural instability), would go a long way towards showing the public what is doable.

Current estimates from the school board for a 2 schools solution don't appear to be grounded in reality.

dokeus6 5 months, 1 week ago

My comment about the elites in Jefferson City? Guess Loreli didnt care for that.

JCLifer 5 months, 1 week ago

Costs for building and remodeling can vary quite a bit too. Are we talking a Cadillac new construction high school? Are we talking Cadillac remodeling of the current JCHS? Are we talking all new furniture, desks, computers for every student in every classroom? What are we really talking about here? Is this a Taj Ma Hal like the Miller Performing Arts Center, or is is a moderate, get-the-job-done high school and remodeling?

Administrators can fanagel the numbers lots of different ways to "prove" their point to make their dreams come true. I guess the biggest issue here is the lack of information. Instead of impassioned pleas that a megaschool with academies will be the cheapest and the best, how about laying out the FACTS and the OPTIONS and let us see what numbers were used for the comarisons?

I am personally for a really nice set of high schools. If I had my way, I would build TWO new and nice high schools. However, I realise that folks in this town are really poor. Many are really struggling to make it in this town with the very low wages, and all the taxes they already have to pay. We have to do what is feasible, but we also need to stretch and do something nice that we can be proud of. After all, this is an INVESTMENT into our town's future economy and for our children's futures.

We really don't know if the board has "fluffed up" the numbers or have they really looked at all the options and realistically priced construction and remodeling costs for a moderate high school.

What we DO KNOW is they paid CADILLAC PRICES for CADILLAC LAND without talking to anyone. That is a huge strike that the BOARD CANNOT BE TRUSTED. We need to know the rest of the details and assumptions used in order to judge for ourselves if the mega school is the right or only choice we have.

RobHunterJohnson 5 months, 1 week ago

I agree JC, I attended a very large high school in the 70s, I have to say they probably did a good job considering the population growth for West St Louis Co! I want the very best for these children, I am a Pipefitter, I want to see the work for myself, brothers, and sisters. I want to see my Tax dollars being invested wisely. I sure do have reservations having been watching from the sidelines for well over 30 years! I cannot help watching how Jefferson City handles everything form parks&rec, P&Z, highways, gas prices, urban renewal, city council, chamber of commerce, and now the school board with their 3.1 million dollar purchase? This format brings it front and center to whom ever the entity may be! Rob

JCLifer 5 months, 1 week ago

How much would a smaller amount of land cost the district if it were located out on Route C just a little ways, or maybe Apache Flats? How about land on Industrial Drive where Maytag used to be? Maybe Edgewood Drive by Ria's restaurant?

If they built an additional high school that held half as many students and they used the current Atkins Stadium for both high schools instead of building another stadium, that would not take nearly as much land. The lot could be a whole lot smaller than the huge land grab on 179.

Surely there is lot's of land available around here for less than $28,000 an acre.

It sounds like the board really didn't investigate the options much. They quickly decided what they wanted and the bought the land for it and are trying to cram the rest of it down the voters' throats. Maybe I am wrong, but that is sure what the appearance of all this is.

PatsyDecline 5 months, 1 week ago

You have already got a possible second high school....it's called the Capital Mall.

Where is the vision of the future among this town's leaders? It's unbelievable to me that nobody seemingly has the ability to consider the repercussions of this hare brained scheme in several decades.

I find it hard to believe that they are that obtuse.

I can believe that football is part of much of this skewed logic. Football....and of course money.

One monster HS is only going to turn into a pseudo prison camp in short order....security will be the overriding concern....they know that....and they know its cheaper to warehouse all the kids in one spot rather than 2.

What says "higher learning" more than K9 teams and metal detectors!

PLUS they will have plenty of money left over for the CONVENTION CENTER!! Its ALL ABOUT THE CHILDREN RIGHT??!! ;)

I've got no skin in this game...I'm outta this burg very soon....but the taxpaying folks that do better wake up and take heed.

You are about to get rolled yet again.

jcguy25 5 months, 1 week ago

What is going to happen to the traffic on that stretch of 179? Is that the same exit for the new St. Mary's Hospital?

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